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Accepted Remove jb_carnival_v2b

Keres

Uncharitable
Joined
Oct 1, 2022
Messages
84
I am suggesting that we remove carnival from the US Jailbreak rotation. There is no denying that the map offers a decent jailbreak experience and has plenty of minigames to experience. However, there are still several issues with the map. It consistently crashes a full server when certain Last Requests are picked, such as valve SMG, Valve rocket launcher, Class wars and so forth. The content the map offers is outweighed by the problems it causes.

To add on to what's been said. Carnival has a system in place where only 1 minigame can be played at a time. This is somewhat problematic due to button griefing. If someone has button griefed the BLUs must locate the minigame that has been turned on and disable it, causing round delay.
 
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crikey

Legendary
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Messages
668
In all honesty, carnival would be one of my favourite maps if it wasn't limited by the technical restrictions of tf2 itself, causing the issues that it currently has. Due to its nature of crashing and other problematic behaviours, I think it is for the best that this map gets removed.
 

SpookyToad

Unremarkable
Joined
Apr 17, 2019
Messages
28
I am suggesting that we remove carnival from the US Jailbreak rotation. There is no denying that the map offers a decent jailbreak experience and has plenty of minigames to experience. However, there are still several issues with the map. It consistently crashes a full server when certain Last Requests are picked, such as valve SMG, Valve rocket launcher, Class wars and so forth. The content the map offers is outweighed by the problems it causes.

To add on to what's been said. Carnival has a system in place where only 1 minigame can be played at a time. This is somewhat problematic due to button griefing. If someone has button griefed the BLUs must locate the minigame that has been turned on and disable it, causing round delay.
"It consistently crashes a full server when certain Last Requests are picked, such as valve SMG, Valve rocket launcher,"

This phrase explains a lot. Valve Rocket Launcher produces MASSIVE amount of edicts. Carnival, due to being big, has big amount of edicts. Rockets being shot are filling this limit and causing server to crash. I don't see what's the point of removing a map if it's plugin's fault. It should be regulated instead and either disable these Last Requests on that map or just replace VRL with something else
 

Pienamai

Face Melting
Joined
Jul 2, 2018
Messages
484
I would just like to note, carnival is not the only map that crashes on those lrs
I have seen it crash on multiple other maps, going through a list of all maps that crush with this LR would mean removing a lot of them
Is this really your issue with the map? Or just the excuse to get it removed.
Maybe it's better to look into those lrs and see if they're really worth it considering their tendency to crash on full servers rather than removing a map due to it, considering this is honestly one of the most unique and creative JB maps as of now, and I have not experienced any other crashes with it outside of those lrs.
And for the minigames, a blue pressing it would count as button griefing, won't it? It's easily punishable. And if they're also pressable by reds, the map is still getting support from the creator, isn't it? I believe he won't be opposed to changing them to blue only to fix this issue
 

Pienamai

Face Melting
Joined
Jul 2, 2018
Messages
484
Carnival, due to being big, has big amount of edicts. Rockets being shot are filling this limit and causing server to crash.
I don't even believe this is the issue due to all the crashes I usually experienced with this LR happened on round start, and I would like to mention again, a lot of them happened on other maps as well.
Again, it might be better to look at the LR itself as the issue rather than the map
 

SpookyToad

Unremarkable
Joined
Apr 17, 2019
Messages
28
I don't even believe this is the issue due to all the crashes I usually experienced with this LR happened on round start, and I would like to mention again, a lot of them happened on other maps as well.
Again, it might be better to look at the LR itself as the issue rather than the map
Truuue
 

Meowsler

Positively Inhumane
Joined
Aug 3, 2021
Messages
392
Excuse me? Why so?
Very dark to see for most people, tries too hard to be an entertaining map layout/prop wise. A majority of secrets if not all of them, are very underwhelming and do not help rebelling at all or just take w a y t o o l o n g and the round ends before completing it. A majority of minigames played are next to cells and doesn't incentivize blues to walk around the map to look for other games (people play obby, sweeper, and 9 square the most cause they're recognizable). But its generally a very bland map. Its easily one of the most unpopular/least played maps to acquire such a status, in fact most people would prefer to play anything else due to how heavily disliked it is (Its rtv'd almost immediately 1-2 rounds in). People would prefer aquarium or even snowballz over this any day.
 

Pienamai

Face Melting
Joined
Jul 2, 2018
Messages
484
Very dark to see for most people, tries too hard to be an entertaining map layout/prop wise. A majority of secrets if not all of them, are very underwhelming and do not help rebelling at all or just take w a y t o o l o n g and the round ends before completing it. A majority of minigames played are next to cells and doesn't incentivize blues to walk around the map to look for other games (people play obby, sweeper, and 9 square the most cause they're recognizable). But its generally a very bland map. Its easily one of the most unpopular/least played maps to acquire such a status, in fact most people would prefer to play anything else due to how heavily disliked it is (Its rtv'd almost immediately 1-2 rounds in). People would prefer aquarium or even snowballz over this any day.
Post a different thread for that map lmao, this ain't about that
 

10000 Cold Knights

Sentinel
Staff Member
Admin
Joined
Feb 20, 2019
Messages
5,794
No, you may not gaslight half of the existing LR's to justify keeping a broken map. If the map is still being worked on the creator can submit an updated map in the future, and that can be readded if it fixes the above issues. The current version should be removed in the meantime however, not being able to run more than one minigame at once is a massive liability (and rather boring, especially on freedays).
 

Pienamai

Face Melting
Joined
Jul 2, 2018
Messages
484
No, you may not gaslight half of the existing LR's to justify keeping a broken map.
That wasn't my intention, I have focused on VRL due to it just being a broken LR that breaks on other maps. But it has been brought to my attention all the other issues this map has, VRL not being the only one.
So I retract my statement, goodbye skeeball :(
 

alexrox360

Strange
Joined
May 8, 2021
Messages
5
No, you may not gaslight half of the existing LR's to justify keeping a broken map. If the map is still being worked on the creator can submit an updated map in the future, and that can be readded if it fixes the above issues. The current version should be removed in the meantime however, not being able to run more than one minigame at once is a massive liability (and rather boring, especially on freedays).
No, you may not gaslight half of the existing LR's to justify keeping a broken map. If the map is still being worked on the creator can submit an updated map in the future, and that can be readded if it fixes the above issues. The current version should be removed in the meantime however, not being able to run more than one minigame at once is a massive liability (and rather boring, especially on freedays)
No, you may not gaslight half of the existing LR's to justify keeping a broken map. If the map is still being worked on the creator can submit an updated map in the future, and that can be readded if it fixes the above issues. The current version should be removed in the meantime however, not being able to run more than one minigame at once is a massive liability (and rather boring, especially on freedays).
I got my edicts down to a stable level (1620 or so) and that’s well in range to be playable on most servers. Are you sure that there are some things in the valve weapon lrs that you could fix to be less edict expensive? I don’t think it’s justifiable to just remove every map you don’t like cause your broken plugin can’t play rocket/smg day well on it by coincidence. Panda servers have the same Valve Rocket day, and it doesn’t crash on my map.
 

Meowsler

Positively Inhumane
Joined
Aug 3, 2021
Messages
392
I got my edicts down to a stable level (1620 or so) and that’s well in range to be playable on most servers. Are you sure that there are some things in the valve weapon lrs that you could fix to be less edict expensive? I don’t think it’s justifiable to just remove every map you don’t like cause your broken plugin can’t play rocket/smg day well on it by coincidence. Panda servers have the same Valve Rocket day, and it doesn’t crash on my map.

Or maybe the map should just get removed, judging by the amount of approval this post is getting 🤝
 

Real Darkness Owl

Blackwonder's Own
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
May 14, 2020
Messages
1,138
We could test it with a new version that has been reduced if there is still no luck. Then we would remove it completely. I pretty much considering giving it another try.
 

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