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Declined Removal of VSH LR

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Hyped

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Jul 8, 2018
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The new jailbreak plugin introduced the Versus Saxton Hale last request.
This new LR just isn’t fun and doesn’t work for many reasons:
1)Bhopping exists and many people run away from the Hale shooting in the hopes of chipping damage just making rounds longer and not fun for people playing and watching
2)Having whole mini games as rounds isn’t fun, and it never will be.
3)Jailbreak maps were made for Jailbreak in mind, as a result vsh isn’t fun because of the map design contributing to the overall poor gameplay. Also...
4)Many people camp Climb and Obby, this isn’t fun for either side. There is also the sweeper in jb_minecraft maps where they insta kill the Hale when they are activated.

And these only scratch the surface of the many issues VSH LRhas.

When VSH LR is picked people just complain about it, it serves no purpose and overall is a bad Last Request.
Please remove thank you. :>
 

Jim

Cutiepie.tf
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1)Bhopping exists and many people run away from the Hale shooting in the hopes of chipping damage just making rounds longer and not fun for people playing and watching
Hale can bhop too so this is irrelevant.
2)Having whole mini games as rounds isn’t fun, and it never will be.
That's just your baseless opinion, not a reason for anything to be changed.
3)Jailbreak maps were made for Jailbreak in mind, as a result vsh isn’t fun because of the map design contributing to the overall poor gameplay. Also...
That's just your baseless opinion, not a reason for anything to be changed. Maybe you want to specify things that make it "not fun".
4)Many people camp Climb and Obby, this isn’t fun for either side. There is also the sweeper in jb_minecraft maps where they insta kill the Hale when they are activated.
Hale has rage, hale is not instantly killed by obbies or other hurt triggers, he loses some hp and is warped to spawn. Sweeper kills him since collisions smoosh him and that's just how the source engine works; Get better and don't jump in sweeper as hale.

The only actual problem with VSH lr that I can see is that most JB people don't play a lot of VSH and aren't as skilled so hale has an easier time winning. The solution to this would be to nerf Hale's hp in the formula.
 

Mars?

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Instead of disagreeing, maybe we could find ways to "solve" this problem.

1. I kind of agree with the bhop problem. Perhaps remove bhop for vsh? Or maybe allow certain classes such as sollys, heavies medics and NOT spies. The long round problem can probably be fixed if the timer was adjusted to be 7 minutes instead.
2. If you claim having a single minigame for the round is not fun, then that means we may have to remove "Obby day" and Climb all day" last request for custom last request.
3. I would prefer more than one opinion about this if it was to be removed, since I personally enjoy it.
4. Even in Blackwonder's VSH servers many engineers and snipers camp in spots. Either way they still get taken down thanks to Hale's balanced rage ability, allowing him to go in to destroy the nest. As you said, SOME maps sweepers and soccer kills hale. So maybe could be fixed.
 

Sleinty

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I don't see this as a problem. I see this as a complaint. (On my point of view)
1. There's nothing wrong with this LR this LR was suggested by the community.
2. You write this maybe you died to Saxton Hale too much/you never play that mod much/you never played it before. (Maybe I'm wrong on this one)
3. LRs was suggested to keep JB going and interesting by the community.
4. I don't see why Bhop should be removed. No good reason. (Unless you just want to point out as a Warden in JB since they keep getting away in Bhop)
5. Dead ringer remove...I don't see a good reason to remove it either. It is part of spy class.
6. Camping in Obby/Climb during hale is completely normal. your complaint about it, because of campers waste time. (I can agree on this one) But they still die to hale's rage.
7. Nerfing Hales HP does not really solve the problem since they one hit every people accept DR spys.
8. Hale jump into sweeper/getting killed by soccer ball is the player problem. (they could just Cap the point to end the game)
9.I'm been honest here. Having New LR is not a bad thing, besides the RTD spams which were removed. you just complain about it because you died too many times (Maybe from the Sniper LR or some other random LR selected) and been salty.
10. Lastly, there's no good reason to remove Vsh LR.
 
D

Deleted member 2049

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1)Bhopping exists and many people run away from the Hale shooting in the hopes of chipping damage just making rounds longer and not fun for people playing and watching
Everyone can bhop, in fact Hale could even bhop by super jumping at an angle to gain faster speed which gives the Hale the upperhand.
2)Having whole mini games as rounds isn’t fun, and it never will be.
This is an opinion not a fact
3)Jailbreak maps were made for Jailbreak in mind, as a result vsh isn’t fun because of the map design contributing to the overall poor gameplay. Also...
I dont see how VSH couldnt be fun just because of how a map layout is, seems more like the map itself... and another opinion.
4)Many people camp Climb and Obby, this isn’t fun for either side. There is also the sweeper in jb_minecraft maps where they insta kill the Hale when they are activated.
This is really the only problem I see with VSH, that and Hale turning on friendly fire with warden. Camping climb seems rather favorable to Reds, which gets annoying if you keep getting pushed back in climb. I've also seen Hale die instantly to the Obby in minecraft because they fell in the pit and tried super jumping back up. Some maps like Hopjb have a way to get into climb without going through the start to get anyone camping, which is good to prevent anyone from staying there.

Seems like most dont want VSH removed, I think it just needs some fixing with people camping places like climb and with Hale still becoming warden. If it's not fun for you, then you have no valid point to make because thats pure opinion
 

Hyped

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Maybe you want to specify things that make it "not fun".
All the maps are designed with the game mode of jailbreak, when you play vsh on jailbreak maps it just isn’t fun because of map design/intentions.
Many maps have a usable glitches and camping spots for a red to go through with the hale being able to do NOTHING about it.
Hale has rage,
>Implying rage will help the hale in the first place take out a sentry nest.
The engineer will always teleport out.
Get better and don't jump in sweeper as hale.
Telling players to get better is difficult considering there have been many instances of reds pushing the hale into sweeper and activating it. That and there’s 3 Minecraft maps in rotation meaning this could be common (I think it works with other maps sweeper)
There are just too many exploits in jailbreak maps for vsh to even work (This is aided by the shit maps in the map pool)
VSH LR is one of the dumbest last requests introduced, only topped by ”Sniper!”
 

Hyped

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Jul 8, 2018
Messages
537

Hyped

Rage Inducing
Joined
Jul 8, 2018
Messages
537
I dont see how VSH couldnt be fun just because of how a map layout is, seems more like the map itself... and another opinion.
Map design plays an important role and contributes significantly to how fun the gamemode is, you will have a bad time if you play jailbreak on a map you do not enjoy playing on. Same thing with VSH. It`s not an opinion, the maps are made for jailbreak so it will negatively affect the gameplay of vsh.

Seems like most dont want VSH removed, I think it just needs some fixing with people camping places like climb and with Hale still becoming warden. If it's not fun for you, then you have no valid point to make because thats pure opinion
Ngl fixing the issues vsh has is a bit more appealing than removing it. But just because its the only issue doesnt undermine it, it breaks the game mode
 

Jim

Cutiepie.tf
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All the maps are designed with the game mode of jailbreak, when you play vsh on jailbreak maps it just isn’t fun because of map design/intentions.
Many maps have a usable glitches and camping spots for a red to go through with the hale being able to do NOTHING about it.
and VSH maps don't have camping spots??? Maybe I think it is fun because it's not designed as a VSH map? You not liking it isn't a reason.
>Implying rage will help the hale in the first place take out a sentry nest.
The engineer will always teleport out.
If you can't kill an engie by the time he can set up level 3 gear again that's your fault.
Telling players to get better is difficult considering there have been many instances of reds pushing the hale into sweeper and activating it. That and there’s 3 Minecraft maps in rotation meaning this could be common (I think it works with other maps sweeper)
There are just too many exploits in jailbreak maps for vsh to even work (This is aided by the shit maps in the map pool)
VSH LR is one of the dumbest last requests introduced, only topped by ”Sniper!”
What's hard about not jumping into a 1% square size of the map? Why not shut sweeper off if reds want to push you in? Why not super jump out before you fall in?
 

Hyped

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and VSH maps don't have camping spots??? Maybe I think it is fun because it's not designed as a VSH map? You not liking it isn't a reason
Are you seriously comparing vsh camping spots to camping in obby/ climb...
It's not just unfun, it's unfair.

If you can't kill an engie by the time he can set up level 3 gear again that's your fault.
Jailbreak maps are often huge. Bigger than vsh maps. And that with the intricacies of obby, maze, climb players have a better chance of setting up a nest. The hale shouldn't be punished because he prevents an engie building a level 3.

What's hard about not jumping into a 1% square size of the map? Why not shut sweeper off if reds want to push you in? Why not super jump out before you fall in?
Just because its small doesn't mean its accessible. Reds have done it before time after time.
The window to super jump is minuscule. And you won`t have it on you all the time.
 

Cytex

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Cytex

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I agree with the removal of the vsh lr, the reason is simple. Jailbreak maps aren't built for vsh, it's like playing ctf but replacing the intel with a capture point it just doesn't work out... and why is this lr even a thing in the first place, I joined to play jailbreak not vsh.
 
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