Declined Give crits back to guards when warden locks (Jailbreak)

[10000 Cold Knights]

Self-explanatory. Just allows reds to steamroll rounds by killing warden and forces blues to go warden in modes like warday even though there really isnt a point to doing so otherwise. It also makes LGKA a nightmare if prisoners are attacking en masse.

 

[ender]

Did guards lose crits again? Didn’t we learn our lesson from last time.

 

[BananAsriel]

Did guards lose crits again? Didn’t we learn our lesson from last time.

as of now crits are removed only when the warden is killed, guards regain crits when someone forces warden

 

[Hyped]

Aren’t crits removed when warden locks rather than the warden just dying?

 

[Benedevil]

Aren’t crits removed when warden locks rather than the warden just dying?

Dis

 

[Peter]

Last gaurd should just go warden and give orders, it is a lot easier to control reds and they will keep their crits. Also, lgka has always been annoying for reds who wanted to get lr and the last guard just waits for warden to lock and kills them.

This way last guard is encouraged to continue the round and give lr or he will most likely die (not a bad thing).

 

[Hyped]

We should always be trying to end rounds with LR given (okay I know I don’t do that). Anyway guards still need some tool to help combat rebels so how about crits are removed when warden locks but Blues get a
1.5 damage multiplication? It encourages blues to keep warden alive and actually have proper rounds while not leaving them totally helpless. There should be some consequences for letting warden lock since you have to be willing to go warden we should discourage those that don’t.

 

[10000 Cold Knights]

We should always be trying to end rounds with LR given (okay I know I don’t do that). Anyway guards still need some tool to help combat rebels so how about crits are removed when warden locks but Blues get a
1.5 damage multiplication? It encourages blues to keep warden alive and actually have proper rounds while not leaving them totally helpless. There should be some consequences for letting warden lock since you have to be willing to go warden we should discourage those that don’t.

Needlessly complicated, but I appreciate the thought.

You may not utilize "last guard kills all" to avoid giving a red LR. If you are the last blue you are obligated to go warden to give the last non rebelling red their LR.

These are the existing restrictions on lgka. There has never been an obligation to forcewarden when a warden dies, if there are complaints about people needlessly enacting lgka, then perhaps an update can be discussed making claiming it more restrictive (like only if over half the reds are rebels, for example). A frankly horrid balance change with basically zero input from a public suggestion (even most staff seemed unaware this was implemented) at least deserves contention.

Last gaurd should just go warden and give orders, it is a lot easier to control reds and they will keep their crits.

I suppose that's correct now, since trying to claim lgka is basically a death sentence currently, but normally rounds are often irredeemable when only 1 guard remains. Trying to give orders will likely get them ran over by the 10+prisoners who have no intention of doing anything other than grabbing ammo and eliminating the last blue. Oftentimes it's not just easier to enact lgka in these situations, its the only viable option.

Also, lgka has always been annoying for reds who wanted to get lr and the last guard just waits for warden to lock and kills them.

And people wonder why I sell out rebels as a red. Personal views aside, if only 2 or 3 reds don't try and rebel and the rest of the team does, blues are gonna claim lgka. That's just life. While I won't deny that certain blues have been claiming lgka in unreasonable situations where there are little to no rebels (looking at you, Hyped and Kirito), forcing a blue into a 1v10+ with no crits and reds having ammo is not an acceptable fix.

This way last guard is encouraged to continue the round and give lr or

That's not the point of lgka. It is meant to be a viable alternative to giving orders if maintaining a round is untenable. We shouldn't be forcing blues to try and give orders in unreasonable situations.
Might make a discord post later regarding the updating of the lgka rules, in the meantime please stop taking crits away from blues. How many times are we gonna have jump through this hoop?

 

[Benedevil]

Why make a suggestion when you are not open to opinions?

 

[Tax Fraud]

Removing crits on warden lock discourages guards from sitting on blue for the sole purpose of racking up massive kill streaks. The point of jailbreak is to play jailbreak. Not a psuedo 1v15 Saxton Hale game mode. Now, people will actually be encouraged to protect the warden or go Warden themselves to salvage a round rather than running for the hills the second he dies.

 

[Hyped]

It doesn’t necessarily mean blues should be totally helpless. Sometimes it does get to a point where you can’t salvage a round and there’s no real point in wardening.

 

[Tax Fraud]

It doesn’t necessarily mean blues should be totally helpless. Sometimes it does get to a point where you can’t salvage a round and there’s no real point in wardening.

The point is you get to keep crits and try to give compliant reds lr. That's one of the core goals of this game mode, is it not?

 

[10000 Cold Knights]

Why make a suggestion when you are not open to opinions?

I believe this is a mistake, and I am suggesting you don't make it. Just because I am disputing opinions doesn't mean I'm not open to hearing them.

Removing crits on warden lock discourages guards from sitting on blue for the sole purpose of racking up massive kill streaks.

As I said to Comet, we can amend the rules to address people misusing lgka. Most blues do not intend to claim it, it is often forced upon them by rebels.

The point of jailbreak is to play jailbreak.

Correct, but how does that justify effectively giving reds the round if warden locks? This change removes crits from blues when they need it the most: on forced freedays, when reds can not only do whatever they wish, but also get to attack first.

Not a psuedo 1v15 Saxton Hale game mode.

I mean it's not like the guards asked you to kill them. These situations only happen when reds disregard the wardens orders and overwhelm blue team, in this "worst case" scenario it makes little sense to deprive blue team of their main advantage.

Now, people will actually be encouraged to protect the warden or go Warden themselves to salvage a round rather than running for the hills the second he dies.

That just leads to death for the blue team most of the time. It's not like they're hanging the warden out to dry, they did what they could to protect him but sometimes it isn't enough. As for running for the hills when the warden dies, that's a smart play. Reds often swarm outward once warden is killed, and since they can attack first, sticking around can be suicide if control can't be reestablished.

The point is you get to keep crits and try to give compliant reds lr. That's one of the core goals of this game mode, is it not?

That can't happen if all the guards are dead, can it?
I say again: if people are having problems with blues leaning too hard on lgka, boundaries can be set regarding when it can be used. How is making it nonviable an alternative to that, especially since blues are forced to wait for warden to lock before they can claim it?

 

[Benedevil]

It doesn’t necessarily mean blues should be totally helpless. Sometimes it does get to a point where you can’t salvage a round and there’s no real point in wardening.

Well then the round is over, and then there is no point anyway to continuing crits or no crits, since it's just deathmatch right?

 

[10000 Cold Knights]

Well then the round is over, and then there is no point anyway to continuing crits or no crits, since it's just deathmatch right?

Technically yes, but its one with significantly unbalanced teams. 1v15's and 1v20's with both sides on equal footing in terms of health, ammo, and damge isn't gonna end well for side A.

 

[Tax Fraud]

Technically yes, but its one with significantly unbalanced teams. 1v15's and 1v20's with both sides on equal footing in terms of health, ammo, and damge isn't gonna end well for side A.

This is what will encourage people to go warden and retain crits to reel the round back in. Perhaps an incentive to go warden while last guard could be added? Like a health buff or passive regen of some sort? Would have to tweak numbers to keep it balanced, but it could help to manage a round while fighting off rebels, like you said.

 

[10000 Cold Knights]

This is what will encourage people to go warden and retain crits to reel the round back in. Perhaps an incentive to go warden while last guard could be added? Like a health buff or passive regen of some sort? Would have to tweak numbers to keep it balanced, but it could help to manage a round while fighting off rebels, like you said.

A lot of servers do have warden-specific buffs, but I still don't get why this change was implemented. It's not like guards were sweeping the rounds with lgka, half the time they just get sniped regardless.

 

[Hyped]

The point is you get to keep crits and try to give compliant reds lr. That's one of the core goals of this game mode, is it not?

But there are cases where you just can’t salvage a round since it’s too late to do so. I agree with you obviously but I feel as if you’re falsely interpreting warden locking as blues being lazy when there are situations where blues just cannot force warden.

 

[Cowboy]

Tbh i think it's kind of crazy that this was implemented. Was there a specific design choice when making this new crit system? Blues are usually at a disadvantage most of the time if the server is full.

We are already having trouble maintaining a healthy population of blu's when the server is full due to the fact that nobody really wants to go blue when the server is approaching 20+ individuals.

 

[Benedevil]

Tbh i think it's kind of crazy that this was implemented. Was there a specific design choice when making this new crit system? Blues are usually at a disadvantage most of the time if the server is full.

We are already having trouble maintaining a healthy population of blu's when the server is full due to the fact that nobody really wants to go blue when the server is approaching 20+ individuals.

Crits are removed when warden is locked. We have not removed crits in any other instance.
Also not many people want to go blue in the fear of breaking rules and getting punished without prior warning.