Declined Auto Scramble

[Philip]

I play on LA 2Fort and usually see a lot of player stacking on one team. Experienced players will usually take one side while the other less experienced and coordinated players will be on the other team. I find it unfair of the normal "new player attack, experienced defend" scheme that has been around for a while.

So, to fix this, I propose a forced autoscramble every 1-5 rounds to keep teams fair for the whole server.

 

[Buster]

You can cast a vote to scramble teams. There is also an auto scramble if the round ends and one of the teams has more players than the other. I'm not convinced we need more than that. And it would be hard to draw the line. If it's every 2 rounds then people get annoyed, if it's every 5 that could take hours.

 

[Philip]

You can cast a vote to scramble teams. There is also an auto scramble if the round ends and one of the teams has more players than the other. I'm not convinced we need more than that. And it would be hard to draw the line. If it's every 2 rounds then people get annoyed, if it's every 5 that could take hours.

I thought it was more of an "Auto balance", but not really a true scramble because the teams usually stay the same. Usually, vote scrambles do not work because of the player stacking issue. The range on the times are decided if this is accepted.

 

[Buster]

Yeah I guess you're right in that it is an auto balance and not a true scramble probably. Anyhow, I don't experience this on EU 2Fort at all, that's why I'm hesitant. My experience is that good players like to play against each other to avoid rounds constantly ending and have challenge.

 

[Philip]

Yeah I guess you're right in that it is an auto balance and not a true scramble probably. Anyhow, I don't experience this on EU 2Fort at all, that's why I'm hesitant. My experience is that good players like to play against each other to avoid rounds constantly ending and have challenge.

Sorry for the late reply

However, this is extremely applicable in the LA 2Fort Server where this has been happening for a long time. Maybe just apply it to that particular server until the problem is fixed.

 

[ʎǝuoɥ ︻デ═一]

As 2Fort is recognized and accepted as an easy-going-style map (due to it's size and historical game play) I too disagree with the need to introduce auto balance to the Blackwonder servers, let alone one-specific-server.

2Fort is a popular small map and people choose to play it for many varying reasons. I, personally, choose to play 2Fort because of it's ease and size. After a busy day it's nice just to go on 2Fort and relax with friends and not have to "work hard" when I'm gaming and in my leisure time. Gaming with friends is my #1 objective to being in TF2 and I enjoy TF2 because it is a TEAM-based game. For me, having that TEAM system in a TEAM-based game makes it so much more enjoyable. I'm not in 2Fort to compete or play a competitive game. I leave that to others who enjoy comp-play in Highlander and 6's outside of 2Fort. So forcing an Auto Balance, especially as often as suggested, will make the gaming session become disjointed and unpleasant. Especially if people have developed a good team among themselves and are capping as often as they do in the LA 2Fort server.

Granted, after 7 years of playing TF2 I've developed my ideal gaming environment and that is within a well-oiled machine-style of a TEAM. I've found communicating via voice and text is highly effective and encourages new and veteran players to form a great team. From time to time it has encouraged the enemy team to do the same and there have been many times where the competition between blu and red has been fierce and wildly fun.

I've always been opposed to the term "stacking" in TF2 as it is a game designed to be worked better as a TEAM. This term "stacking" essentially breaks down this ideal and sends the message that working effectively as a team is frowned on in a TEAM-based game.

 

[Philip]

As 2Fort is recognized and accepted as an easy-going-style map (due to it's size and historical game play) I too disagree with the need to introduce auto balance to the Blackwonder servers, let alone one-specific-server.

2Fort is a popular small map and people choose to play it for many varying reasons. I, personally, choose to play 2Fort because of it's ease and size. After a busy day it's nice just to go on 2Fort and relax with friends and not have to "work hard" when I'm gaming and in my leisure time. Gaming with friends is my #1 objective to being in TF2 and I enjoy TF2 because it is a TEAM-based game. For me, having that TEAM system in a TEAM-based game makes it so much more enjoyable. I'm not in 2Fort to compete or play a competitive game. I leave that to others who enjoy comp-play in Highlander and 6's outside of 2Fort. So forcing an Auto Balance, especially as often as suggested, will make the gaming session become disjointed and unpleasant. Especially if people have developed a good team among themselves and are capping as often as they do in the LA 2Fort server.

Granted, after 7 years of playing TF2 I've developed my ideal gaming environment and that is within a well-oiled machine-style of a TEAM. I've found communicating via voice and text is highly effective and encourages new and veteran players to form a great team. From time to time it has encouraged the enemy team to do the same and there have been many times where the competition between blu and red has been fierce and wildly fun.

I've always been opposed to the term "stacking" in TF2 as it is a game designed to be worked better as a TEAM. This term "stacking" essentially breaks down this ideal and sends the message that working effectively as a team is frowned on in a TEAM-based game.

I agree with most of your points. It is important in TF2 to have times for relaxation and friends as well as good team coordination. From what I've experienced, imbalance is not felt by the "winning" team. Heck, when I play on the "winning" team, all I have to do is let the opponents come to me, with me being more focused on kills/steamrolling rather than balance. On the other side of the spectrum, it is difficult to attack such a secure base full of more experienced players. Even if there is the possible solution of "get gud", the attacking players are at a large disadvantage with less experience, height advantage, and team coordination. Even if the "winning team" does attack the opposing base, it's hard to defend due to the attack mindset already instilled. The members of the opposing team feel disheartened at failing to even get close to the other side. In a nutshell, it's not fun to fight against. There is a reason why most of the time the attacking side is always short on a few players.

(But, it did force me to main Sniper... as the coward I am :3)

I think its all based on perspective.

 

[ʎǝuoɥ ︻デ═一]

From what I've experienced, imbalance is not felt by the "winning" team.

Given the laid-back-nature of 2Fort the question arises: "Does anyone really WIN when playing 2Fort?" Yeah, sure there's capping involved but a good portion of the game is spent in varying degrees of seriousness. There are often people that want to play as a 'Friendly' or others having 'Hoovy Fights in the sewers'. Others still that will have demo challenges on the bridge and yet more just wanting to have Taunt-killing matches. Mixed with this are those who like to play the objective and play strategically, so overall the activity within a server, and more specifically in the LA 2Fort server (as this is the thread's target location) has varying game styles intermingled together.

Even if there is the possible solution of "get gud", the attacking players are at a large disadvantage with less experience, height advantage, and team coordination. Even if the "winning team" does attack the opposing base, it's hard to defend due to the attack mindset already instilled. The members of the opposing team feel disheartened at failing to even get close to the other side. In a nutshell, it's not fun to fight against. There is a reason why most of the time the attacking side is always short on a few players.

This isn't necessarily always the case if any particular side decides to 'attack' a base. The winning formula will always be "Work as a Team". I've experienced many different scenarios of defending against a very strong Offensive Team and being part of a strong Offensive Team. There will be many deaths and victories on both sides, but if your objective is to Have a Great Time no matter who 'caps out the game' and you're still laughing at the end of the round it's been a successful game in my book. Players leaving the server and causing a team player-count to diminish cannot always be attributed to being disheartened. It's acknowledged that there will be some who will experience those feelings, but it's not the case for many.

Having played sports from a very young age, I've learned the value of not only working as a team, but also rallying your teammates and encouraging everyone to aim for a common cause... whatever that may be.

Perhaps, this will be a good opportunity to build a great team among your own side and develop good camaraderie with new and older players alike.

 

[Kerknor]

I agree with most of your points. It is important in TF2 to have times for relaxation and friends as well as good team coordination. From what I've experienced, imbalance is not felt by the "winning" team. Heck, when I play on the "winning" team, all I have to do is let the opponents come to me, with me being more focused on kills/steamrolling rather than balance. On the other side of the spectrum, it is difficult to attack such a secure base full of more experienced players. Even if there is the possible solution of "get gud", the attacking players are at a large disadvantage with less experience, height advantage, and team coordination. Even if the "winning team" does attack the opposing base, it's hard to defend due to the attack mindset already instilled. The members of the opposing team feel disheartened at failing to even get close to the other side. In a nutshell, it's not fun to fight against. There is a reason why most of the time the attacking side is always short on a few players.

(But, it did force me to main Sniper... as the coward I am :3)

I think its all based on perspective.

So I have read through the points made here and most I can agree with. However, as you have pointed out "I think its all based on perspective" it makes it more difficult to make a change when its not an issue but rather a opinion on personal game-play. The great thing about TF2 is a brand new player can come in 'W+M1' and kill even seasoned players. Hence why so many people make complaints about it. Yes it can be more difficult for a less experienced "team" to take on a seasoned team but it really doesn't change the core of 2Fort.

Let's say both teams are equally balanced in every way, experience, skill, class arrangement.The attacking team is ALWAYS going to be at an disadvantage. Defending allows that team to set up for kills while the attackers have to do it on the fly. So as far as that goes to help with balancing, I don't think it would fly.

As far as auto-scramble goes. Like Buster pointed out, one does happen at the end of the round. Yes it is more of a Balance then a scramble. Scrambling teams however wouldn't do much when people that are playing with friends, simply switch right back. Forcing that type of scramble every few rounds or even every 5 doesn't seem to fix the problem you are having and referring too.

Who will determine if one team is too experienced? Too strong? You can't use the points tab because that could be representative of time in the server. Can't use Dom's. The less experienced players could be defending and getting kills that way. What if there is a very experienced team but the other team has a Med-Combo team that is able to kill almost everyone? There are a lot of variables in there that I don't think you are considering that a Auto-Scramble doesn't apply too, nor would it help.

My 2 Cents.

 

[Philip]

Given the laid-back-nature of 2Fort the question arises: "Does anyone really WIN when playing 2Fort?" Yeah, sure there's capping involved but a good portion of the game is spent in varying degrees of seriousness. There are often people that want to play as a 'Friendly' or others having 'Hoovy Fights in the sewers'. Others still that will have demo challenges on the bridge and yet more just wanting to have Taunt-killing matches. Mixed with this are those who like to play the objective and play strategically, so overall the activity within a server, and more specifically in the LA 2Fort server (as this is the thread's target location) has varying game styles intermingled together.




This isn't necessarily always the case if any particular side decides to 'attack' a base. The winning formula will always be "Work as a Team". I've experienced many different scenarios of defending against a very strong Offensive Team and being part of a strong Offensive Team. There will be many deaths and victories on both sides, but if your objective is to Have a Great Time no matter who 'caps out the game' and you're still laughing at the end of the round it's been a successful game in my book. Players leaving the server and causing a team player-count to diminish cannot always be attributed to being disheartened. It's acknowledged that there will be some who will experience those feelings, but it's not the case for many.

Having played sports from a very young age, I've learned the value of not only working as a team, but also rallying your teammates and encouraging everyone to aim for a common cause... whatever that may be.

Perhaps, this will be a good opportunity to build a great team among your own side and develop good camaraderie with new and older players alike.

I totally agree!
Thanks for helping me see the other side

(Maybe because I am a wussy sniper main I cannot handle spam..."

 

[Kerknor]

I totally agree!
Thanks for helping me see the other side

(Maybe because I am a wussy sniper main I cannot handle spam..."

It can always be helpful to see things from the other side of the coin, but its even harder to accept them. Good on you! Hey I'm a sniper main, spam can be a pain but can be dealt with easily.

 

[Philip]

It can always be helpful to see things from the other side of the coin, but its even harder to accept them. Good on you! Hey I'm a sniper main, spam can be a pain but can be dealt with easily.

How to get rid of spam:
1. Equip Machina
2. Fully charge
3. Annihilate entire team