Resolved Admin Abuse?

[Ezra]

Playing Blackwonder NY Turbine with people. The bottom entrance had sentries the past few rounds, so this round we decided to go past their spawn and walk down the stairs to the intel room because it would be easier to kill the sentry from there. Two people were banned for "spawn camping" despite being there collectively for 30 seconds. The only reason why they went there was to leave immediately and capture. I think John (one of the two who were banned) got 1 kill on a pyro chasing him away because he had their intel. None of us prevented them from spawning. We left almost immediately unless we were being fired at.

Of course, Kerknor and his friends are free to do anything they want to do. Using the all chat microphone as if they were having a full blown conversation and talking to us in a demeaning way. This isn't the first time they were rude on this server. They join the server when there are a good amount of people on. They all stack onto one team and cap even if we're not planning on capping. It's not their first time doing this. They continue this ridiculing until the entire server is empty... Again, it's not the first time it has happened.

Raiin's ban appeal
Admin's name: Kerknor

I'll upload the full demo if requested.

 

[Ezra]

Here's my demo, I just put got back to my PC.

I'll copy what I said from Raiin's appeal (a moderator declined me from uploading this on Raiin's ban appeal. I posted this an hour before it was finally archived. I don't understand why, though... RainbowRob asked me for the ticks and I've supplied them, and my message was deleted.):

What is the time/tick evidence of this

View attachment 10231
All previous rounds, intel room had a sentry looking into this room, so you would have to attack from the staircase leading to their spawn room to actually damage the sentry from a distance or use an uber.

Ticks:
158129 - Beginning of the round
163000 - Raiin fires a rocket up the staircase at a pyro, enemy soldier was guarding vents so he shoots there as well.
169000 - Raiin gets the intel and goes up to the spawn room for their first time. He was leaving, you can see there were people in spawn but he didn't stay (two pyros can be seen). He stays to protect his pocket medic and leaves. He was aiming his rockets at people who had already left spawn and was attacking him.
172500 - Raiin goes through their spawn again to investigate why they're not leaving. They're just using roll the dice the whole time. He rocket jumps and grabs the intel before even I get it. I was a medic walking straight for the intel.

Now, I didn't follow and record what he did in front of their spawn, luckily, Kerknor was recording.

174451 - Is synced with 12 seconds in kerknor's video ^

The reason we were checking up on their spawn was because everyone was active, people were defending, people were using their microphones and scolding us for talking back to honey because she would not stop talking to people in a demeaning manner.

The next round, it was odd that all but 1 person left the next round (eventually he stayed in spawn as well), no one was using their microphones, people were taunting and using rtd (so we know they weren't afk, I think raiin meant they were idle). It was just radio silence.

137250 - The beginning of the previous round.
101684 - Kerknor as heavy going to our spawn and up the stairs. While he does fire at the sentry, if there were people spawning he'd probably shoot them.
112000 - Raiin joins.
Every round you can see how filled the lower room is.

Additionally your ban is already expired so I feel like this is a waste of time.

The reason why I still want his ban to be removed from record is because the next time he's banned, it'll be 3 days rather than just 24 hours. He should just get a 24 hour ban next time since this one seemed unfair. To me, it does appear personal, because he engaged in an argument with honey (who I'm assuming is his girlfriend or close friend, they always play together) because she would not stop using her microphone to ridicule.

 

[Corrin]

Please remove the music, it's really unnecessary here, but I have no control over that.

Change the title please, just for something more friendly like: Blackwonder Proof

Your friend at 2:41 should probably watch his mouth about the admins there, pretty disrespectful words over someone who has the authority to do many things to us.

Leave out the kill count, I don't think we really needed it that much, as you only assisted the soldier throughout the whole gameplay.

 

[Ezra]

Please remove the music, it's really unnecessary here, but I have no control over that.

Change the title please, just for something more friendly like: Blackwonder Proof

Your friend at 2:41 should probably watch his mouth about the admins there, pretty disrespectful words over someone who has the authority to do many things to us.

Leave out the kill count, I don't think we really needed it that much, as you only assisted the soldier throughout the whole gameplay.

It would've been boring without music, but I can upload the entire demo once I'm on my PC again.

My friend was mad because there was no warning, unless you count the admin saying, "don't spawn camp" moments before banning them. I was told from another admin that you need multiple warnings before being banned for spawn camping, he only gave them 1, and their only 1 was him giving him the warning as he banned him. It's stupid, and I believe he's justified (albeit a little rude).

The kills are not my kills but the Soldier's. The soldier got 0 kills. The person banned for spawn camping didn't get a single kill.

 

[Cammy]

Technically, warnings aren't needed. They're a courtesy given incase people haven't read the rules or ignored the very obvious popup that appears every time you connect to the server.

The popup when you connect is the first warning you get.


You also don't need to kill someone to be spawncamping. Notice the CAMPING part, and the lack of KILLING part.

 

[Ezra]

Technically, warnings aren't needed. They're a courtesy given incase people haven't read the rules or ignored the very obvious popup that appears every time you connect to the server.

The popup when you connect is the first warning you get.


You also don't need to kill someone to be spawncamping. Notice the CAMPING part, and the lack of KILLING part.

Even with the pop-up, that's two warnings (I'll give the admin the benefit of the doubt and count his message before banning as a warning). I was told you needed multiple warnings since it's a big punishment.

According to the rules, we'd have to be preventing people from spawning in order to be spawn camping. We were not even staying at their spawn for a significant amount of time.

We didn't even prevent them from leaving spawn (as seen in the video). We didn't kill anyone, we didn't prevent anyone from leaving spawn, we didn't camp their spawn. We walked through to cap the Intel on turbine.

 

[Cammy]

Whoever told you that is wrong. One warning, preferably written, is enough. If you fail to notice it and get punished, or simply ignore it, you are the one at fault.

I don't know what rule you're reading, but the rule for spawncamping is as follows: "Do not stop the enemies from being able to leave the spawn room."

If you're sat there firing rockets/camping as sniper (in this case since it's turbine,) at the top of the stairs, or otherwise hanging around, even if you're not shooting, you are considered to be camping as you are a threat to the enemies leaving their spawn room.

As for the third portion, one clip has already disproven that statement in the case of John's appeal. By the looks of it on Raiins appeal, John was just banned and Raiin decided to bait out Kerknor by sitting in the same place, bhopping and hanging around the stairs shooting rockets at the spawn doors with the intel.


Edit: Some admins are more lenient than others and will offer up more warnings, and while I am not an admin, I prefer the one warning policy.

 

[Ezra]

Whoever told you that is wrong. One warning, preferably written, is enough. If you fail to notice it and get punished, or simply ignore it, you are the one at fault.

I don't know what rule you're reading, but the rule for spawncamping is as follows: "Do not stop the enemies from being able to leave the spawn room."

If you're sat there firing rockets/camping as sniper (in this case since it's turbine, at the top of the stairs), or otherwise hanging around, even if you're not shooting, you are considered to be camping as you are a threat to the enemies leaving their spawn room.

As for the third portion, one clip has already disproven that statement in the case of John's appeal. By the looks of it on Raiins appeal, John was just banned and Raiin decided to bait out Kerknor by sitting in the same place, bhopping and hanging around the stairs shooting rockets at the spawn doors with the intel.


Edit: Some admins are more lenient than others and will offer up more warnings, and while I am not an admin, I prefer the one warning policy.

Look at Raiin's SC video, he isn't camping and spamming rockets. He picked up the ammo, shot a rocket and left fairly quickly. No one left spawn because he was recording and kerknor told his friends not to leave.

 

[Kerknor]

kerknor told his friends not to leave.

Nope

 

[Ezra]

Nope

Alright, that's fair, but he clearly isn't camping or preventing anyone from leaving spawn. He picked up an ammo pack, shot a rocket and left. If anyone is wondering where I got the "preventing people from leaving spawn" thing, it's from this website if you go to DM rules.

I still fail to see how your clip of him shooting 1 rocket and leaving gets him banned for 24 hours.

 

[Cammy]

Because the warning was given prior to the punishment, and someone else got punished shortly before he did.

Assuming you three are friends, you, john and rain, rain would've known to not push his luck by going to the exact same spot john was in, and then hop around like loon for a few seconds.

Alright, so he comes in and rocket jumps to get ahead of the spawn doors, reloads his rocket launcher after picking up the ammo while staring at the spawn doors. He could've been walking with the intel while reloading at this point. You can easily hear the spawn doors opening as you descend the stairs.

From 8 seconds onwards to the end of the clip, he is bhopping on the stairs waiting for a target to come out of the doors, where he could've instead been running on with the intel.

If what was said in the original appeal is true, the enemy team being afk in spawn, there was no reason for him to stick around at all other than to try and kill someone leaving the spawn door. They knew their team is on the other side of the door downstairs, so there's no danger whatsoever in moving forward to cap instead of sticking around on the top of the stairs like they did.

While the clip may be short, the intention is visible.


I might also add: Don't be a smartass and try to bait the admin-on-duty that's just punished your friend for spawncamping in the exact same spot, it doesn't end well.

 

[Ezra]

Because the warning was given prior to the punishment, and someone else got punished shortly before he did.

Assuming you three are friends, you, john and rain, rain would've known to not push his luck by going to the exact same spot john was in, and then hop around like loon for a few seconds.

Alright, so he comes in and rocket jumps to get ahead of the spawn doors, reloads his rocket launcher after picking up the ammo while staring at the spawn doors. He could've been walking with the intel while reloading at this point. You can easily hear the spawn doors opening as you descend the stairs.

From 8 seconds onwards to the end of the clip, he is bhopping on the stairs waiting for a target to come out of the doors, where he could've instead been running on with the intel.

If what was said in the original appeal is true, the enemy team being afk in spawn, there was no reason for him to stick around at all other than to try and kill someone leaving the spawn door.

While the clip may be short, the intention is visible.


I might also add: Don't be a smartass and try to bait the admin-on-duty that's just punished your friend for spawncamping in the exact same spot, it doesn't end well.

No, he wasn't bunny hopping at the stairs waiting for someone. I had the rest of what Raiin was doing in my demo. After the last 8 seconds he bhopped down the stairs, left and before he could rocket jump again, he was slain and banned. He wasn't "baiting" the admin either. They haven't been out of spawn for that entire round (it's in my 45 minute demo). We could hear taunting in the distance, so he checked it out.

 

[Cammy]

Well then post the full demo on the appeal for it to be looked at.

 

[Ezra]

Well then post the full demo on the appeal for it to be looked at.

I've said earlier that I don't have access to my PC, however, the demo is already sent to the admin on Raiin's appeal. He should already have the demo.

 

[Tax Fraud]

Why wouldn’t you just upload the full demo from the start?

 

[Ezra]

Why wouldn’t you just upload the full demo from the start?

This video is just showing a summary of what happened since it's about admin abuse (or badmins), hence the title.

I didn't get banned so I don't need a demo to get myself appealed. The full demo is on Raiin's appeal. I'll post it here when I have the chance. It's 45 minutes.

 

[RainbowRobb]

I'll watch through the other demo you say is on raiins appeal. But spawn camping is one of the most basic rules of any FPS, ever.

Related, I don't know the context of how you asked the admin about this, or what they said, but sentiment is wrong. If it's a slightly more complicated game mode like JB, then sure, more warning may be appropriate. But not for spawncamping on a death match mode.

But as I said, I'll watch it. But I can tell you definitively, that this won't cause the admin to have the privileges stripped.