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VSH Balancing Ideas

ARC_Winters

Scarcely Lethal
Joined
Jan 4, 2021
Messages
39
Some of my ideas for balancing for Versus Saxton Hale

Many of my ideas may already have been considered/ already in the game, I may not realise that considering that the stats don't stay up nor can I view them easily. Sorry for that.
I also know that my ideas may not be added, but I would at least like to give my ideas.
And if anyone else has some more ideas for changes, we can add them here in hopes we can get some changes to help both veteran's and new players.

Edit: Because of the feedback and criticism that I have gotten from people in-game and on discord, I have decided to update the post to hopefully get something changed to make Versus Saxton Hale more enjoyable for everyone.

I've also decided to add my reasonings to all the changes to give better insight as to why I have asked for a specific change.

Please fix Sky-High Resort point camping..
I'm even willing to make a separate post about this.


This isn't related, but I've lost about an hour writing this due to my computer bugging out on me. Thanks computer, would love to save drafts...


Green - Buffs
Red - Nerfs

General:
+ Give players that just join the Versus Saxton Hale server less priority when joining for the day.
• This is just to give people who just join a chance at getting in the server for a player round before becoming Hale the first thing they join a server. Just gives everyone a breather.
- Goomba damage % per player decreased.
• As I've seen it, it can range from 2,000 damage to 500 damage per goomba. All I am asking for is the max damage to at least be lowered so the Hale isn't overwhelmed.
- Any taunt kills should deal more damage.
• All taunt kills are extremely hard to pull off but only do exactly 450 damage and I believe a feat should do lots more damage. This would also give more ways to kill Hale in silly and goofy ways.

Hale:
+ A little bit of decreased knockback would be nice.
• I've seen and have had may difficult times trying to assault an enginerr nest and a heavy group with amp and dispenser nearby to help them, it makes extremely difficult as you are thrown away and will have an extremely harder time to try and kill those players as Hale. Vagineer rage uber is the only way to get there as by the time you get halfway, you are thrown away and your rage cannot hit those players or sentries, especially if there is more than one sentry.
+ A little extra health % per player for newer players.
• As we've discussed, there is a way to implement a system to give newer players that have no idea what they are doing a better chance of being able to handle players with more health. I feel like this would be a good decision. Can you also maybe change the tool tip to instead of crouch and look up to super jump, make it right-click and look up.
+ Christian Brutal Sniper rage range stun is increased a little bit.
• Even though this can conflict with the next suggestion/idea, I feel like this can be a given as Christian Brutal Sniper has a harder time when dealing in close range with his stun as it doesn't give him enough breathing room to make players back up and run. The first layer would soon get replaced with the second layer and he's back to being swarmed once the rage stun duration is over.
~ Make Hale Rage, Stun Range, and Stun Duration based on the amount of players rather than a set amount.
• I feel like making this change to Hale and his variants would be a good change as it balances it out for all players instead of making a buff to one Hale instead of just one or the other.
- Reduce the explosion radius for Robot Saxton Hale.
• Even though Robot Saxton Hale is immobilized, there are ways to get around this which would catch many players, even myself, off guard. If he is indeed immobilized now, it would be unnecessary to keep his explosion radius where it is currently at.

Scout:
+ Baby Face's Blaster boost stays for longer.
•The boost duration per hit disappears almost instantly as you get it, which would make sense as you are attempting to run away from a Hale while doing damage, this makes sense. But the instant depletion of that boost is not consistent and I would like it to be increased to give those players a chance at staying alive.
- Soda Popper duration is decreased.
• With how long it lasts, it lasts for far too long with what you can do with the HYPE meter duration. You can either deal goomba damage with how high you can jump or jump away many times with how long that HYPE meter last. I am asking for a decrease in that duration for those reasons alone.

Soldier:
+ Half-Zatoichi gives more health per swing.
• If a Hale is hitting as much as a soldier is with this melee and a Battalion's Back up, the Hale will always win. I figure that the Half-Zatoichi for soldier shouldn't give any overheal but should give more health per swing hit to give back more than what is dealt or at least even the damage received to make this combo viable more for soldier other than Trolldier.
- Fix the "Guntreads" bug.
• Equip Mantreads and before you get revived after dying or after that round ends, equip the Gunboats and you'll receive the boost from Mantreads and get the damage reduction from Gunboats. I'm asking for it to be fixed to make it fair.

Pyro:
+ Phlogistinator MMMPH duration is longer.
• The duration is short enough that a Hale can basically outrun you and you've wasted the duration fully. This should at least allow a pyro to catch up to deal some damage as a Hale runs away half the time or tries to kill you the other half the time.
- Phlogistinator MMMPH damage is lowered.
• Because the duration is longer, the damage should receive a slight nerf to offset that buff to not make it extremely overpowered. This would only apply when MMMPH is activated.
- Decrease the amount of rage given to Hale from airblast from 8% (I think this is how much.) to 3%.
• I understand this would basically remove the punishment that trolls can do, but that's what the next idea goes into depth about. It can stay or go, but it less punishes the team instead of the trolling pyro.
- Give a cooldown to airblast after it has been used too much and/or make it so that after airblast, the cost goes up by 5+ to a max of 100 ammo used per airblast.
• As we've both talked and got out own ideas and criticism out, I believe that either is a better suggestion to make than what I had initially suggested. The cooldown is a better idea for the trolling pyros to punish them for airblasting too much to make sure the Hale can punish them for airblasting instead of just letting the pyro airblast for easy rage. The ammo idea increase is a slightly better idea to punish the pyro for dispenser camping to give them a harder time at airblast spamming. Both are great ways to punish a trolling pyro.

Demoman:
+ Half-Zatoichi gives more hp per swing and can overheal to survive at least 1 hit from Hale.
• The Half-Zatoichi for Demoman gives not enough overheal to survive one hit and the Hale can instantly kill the player not matter what loadout the Demoman has set up. This would give the Demoman another viable sword rather than just Eyelander.

Heavy:
Perfectly Balanced.

Engineer:
- Telefrag doing max 9,000 damage.
• I really do understand that this is definitely a map problem for Sky-High, but I want to give one more reason for this. This is a base game thing for it to insta-kill, but to have a round end within a minute is not fun for both Hale and Players especially if it is for several rounds even with Hale players above 9,000+ health. This can also happen on maps other than Sky-High which is just boring and part of a problem that continues to grow.

Medic:
- Reduce the starting uber from 45% to 10-20%.
• This is way too much considering how fast a medic can get an uber and sustain an uber. If a Hale player cannot pick off the medics, the amount of uber and ubered players will be able to swarm the Hale player, making it nearly impossible for the Hale to win.
- Reduce the given uber from after an uber usage from 20% to 5-10%
• This falls into the first nerf for the medic, it allows the medic to get a lot of ubers way too fast which prevents the Hale from either killing them, or killing other players, making it nearly impossible for the Hale to win.
- Reduce the uber charge rate.
• Again, this makes the Medic way too powerful and is a deserved nerf as it gives the medic less than a minute, making it harder for the Hale to stop the ubers which the medic can get very quickly with how fast the charge rate is at right now.
- Reduce how much uber is gained from syringes hitting Hale.
• As I have been told by players that actually use syringe guns instead of the Crusader's Crossbow, it gives 5% per hit excluding the Overdose which gives 1% per hit. The 5% is way too much and the syringe guns should match the 1% that the Overdose has. That is more fair and balanced.
- Reduce how much uber is gained from Crusader's Crossbow bolt hitting Hale.
• I personally use the Crusader's Crossbow and the 15% is way too much with how much the medic gets uber with hitting your shots. This may reward good shots, but this is ridiculous with how medic is currently and there are many complaints. Reduce this down to half or lower and this will be fine enough.

Sniper:
+ Sydney Sleeper should reduce Hale's rage with fully charged shots.
• As I have been told by many many players, this is not needed but this should've been added and the Sydney Sleeper mechanic could be used in some way like this. With the nerf to knockback based on the charge, this should be an okay change as every other sniper rifle is still usable.
- Have knockback based on the amount of charge you have from being zoomed in.
• This should be a given as any shot, scoped in or scoped out do the same amount of knockback that annoy and pester hale way too much with how the knockback is currently. With no charge, the knockback should be minimal and a fully charged shot should be significant.
- Unscoped shots have little to no knockback.
•The knockback is the same as a scoped shot, but this also allows the sniper to at least escape a Hale player so this change is a suggestion and I am not expecting it to become a thing.

Spy:
- Fix the goomba insta-kill bug.
• This falls under telefrags, it happens more and more and insta-kills the Hale at any health. As I've been told if a spy goomba's and backstabs a hale at the same time, that just gets annoying to deal with as it happens more than you can think.
 
Last edited:

Killer Kitten

Strange
Joined
Jan 8, 2023
Messages
5
I agree with most

minus the robo hale nerf (I just keep distant if ik hale has rage)

and with airblasting pyros ether just increase the cost per air blast by +5 and cap it out at 100 cost maximum (if they get to the point they airblasted that much) or get rid of the reduced mobility from air blast.
 

10000 Cold Knights

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+ A little extra health % per player for newer players. (A lot more newer have been joining lately).
Newer players could have 30k extra health and they'd still get bodied. This would just make the good players even harder to take out.
+ 1 more second stun for Vagineer. (Meant to give the uber'd Vagineer more time to pray on stunned players while staying uber'd).
Idk, that's a pretty nice buff for a hale that's already one of the strongest.
- Reduce the explosion radius for Robot Saxton Hale. (Many complaints, not from me, but am willing to ask for it).
Not necessary, now that he's finally immobilized while exploding. Either don't bunch up right in front of him or be ready to scatter once he's taken a good amount of damage.
- Decrease the amount of rage given to Hale from airblast from 8% (I think this is how much.) to 3%.
- Increase the ammo used per airblast.
Something should be done about airblast noobs/trolls, but I don't think this is the answer. Spammers can just camp a dispenser to get more value out of their AB, and good players seem punished by contrast.
- Reduce the damage dealt from having a lot of stickies placed even more.
- Telefrag doing max 9000 damage. (Controversial, but still warranted).
I get that center camping on sky-high can be oppressive, but that's more of a map problem than a weapon problem. I'd rather adjust Hale's teleporting location than nerf one of the hardest methods of damage dealing in the game, as well as one of the few non-demoknight strats in vsh.

I dont think we can afford to add a spy class limit, we already have several limits in place as it is.
 

Lord Of Something

Positively Inhumane
Joined
Dec 25, 2019
Messages
380
it would be interesting if the rage, stun range and duration, based on the amount of players ALIVE


currently if you are not someone who really knows how to play(pro), being hale with more than 10 reds is not fun, especially when you have many medics and sentrys, sentry knocback is insane even at level 1, this is something default from the tf itself
 

ARC_Winters

Scarcely Lethal
Joined
Jan 4, 2021
Messages
39
Newer players could have 30k extra health and they'd still get bodied. This would just make the good players even harder to take out.
Is there a way to track this and have it implemented that way? I would understand if not and I agree with that second statement as I've seen some good hale players barely drop 10-20% in health.


Idk, that's a pretty nice buff for a hale that's already one of the strongest.
It was an idea, but with Lord Of Something has stated, that is a better idea to implement.
it would be interesting if the rage, stun range and duration, based on the amount of players ALIVE


Not necessary, now that he's finally immobilized while exploding. Either don't bunch up right in front of him or be ready to scatter once he's taken a good amount of damage.
Believe it or not, Robot Saxton Hale can still move at sometimes if he is knocked back in any way, which does allow him to move. There are other ways that he can still move which can catch players off-guard when they are hiding from line of sight or running away which has led to many many deaths.


Something should be done about airblast noobs/trolls, but I don't think this is the answer. Spammers can just camp a dispenser to get more value out of their AB, and good players seem punished by contrast.
Understandable, I agree that something should be done, and if it counts towards griefing, which I do believe it does based on the context of the said rule, is that not a reportable offence and could we implement an idea to class ban a person? And with what Killer Kitten has said may be the better idea than what I had in contrast to stop them from camping a dispenser.
and with airblasting pyros ether just increase the cost per air blast by +5 and cap it out at 100 cost maximum (if they get to the point they airblasted that much) or get rid of the reduced mobility from air blast.


I get that center camping on sky-high can be oppressive, but that's more of a map problem than a weapon problem. I'd rather adjust Hale's teleporting location than nerf one of the hardest methods of damage dealing in the game, as well as one of the few non-demoknight strats in vsh.
I actually never thought of it that way, which is a good point, it is a map problem rather than a weapon problem. Is there a way to contact the map maker to adjust this to a random location or a set location that can prevent camping the hale spawn, like the map vsh_2fortdesk_v8 where the fall down location is in the air for hale but falling too much lowers that spawn point.
I do not know if there is already a set plugin for the demo stickies as I've been led to believe, which is fine enough as sticky traps happen everywhere, not just Sky-High which is a good strat if not on the receiving end of such sticky trap where it removes 15-25% of a hale's health pool like a market garden or spy backstab.
Fair enough, I tried.


I dont think we can afford to add a spy class limit, we already have several limits in place as it is.
This was another controversial ones that I speculated would get this response as there are a lot of classes limited as well. I understand this one completely, thank you.
 

Chris TCC

Blackwonder's Own
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Is there a way to track this and have it implemented that way?
theoretically, yes. In practice it'd be a pain, cause unnecessary load on the server, and if the database connection goes down, the system would consider everyone new, and give everyone the bonus.
Understandable, I agree that something should be done, and if it counts towards griefing, which I do believe it does based on the context of the said rule, is that not a reportable offence and could we implement an idea to class ban a person? And with what Killer Kitten has said may be the better idea than what I had in contrast to stop them from camping a dispenser.
the goal for this is to allow airblast, and target those who spam, whilst leaving it open as an option for those who use it properly. What is the difference in their usage?
As far as I know, we could maybe consider adding some kind of airblast cooldown maybe? (5 airblasts within 15 seconds or something)
 

ARC_Winters

Scarcely Lethal
Joined
Jan 4, 2021
Messages
39
theoretically, yes. In practice it'd be a pain, cause unnecessary load on the server, and if the database connection goes down, the system would consider everyone new, and give everyone the bonus.
Or do it the other way around so a just in case method in case the servers go down or set up like a pop-up so that newer players can select the option for a health handicap if they've lost a number of times as hale?


the goal for this is to allow airblast, and target those who spam, whilst leaving it open as an option for those who use it properly. What is the difference in their usage?
Hence why you'd punish the ones who can save their airblast rather than spam it. If this were the case, it'd get singular people killed or a whole group for spammers and the ones who use it properly can save a team or themselves when all alone. The difference would be preserve vs troll.
As far as I know, we could maybe consider adding some kind of airblast cooldown maybe? (5 airblasts within 15 seconds or something)
That'd be a good idea.
 

ARC_Winters

Scarcely Lethal
Joined
Jan 4, 2021
Messages
39
Since I got a lot of criticism and feedback, I've decided to change what we have talked about both in-game and in discord, deleted and added one or two things, and added why I think they would be great changes to better understand my mind in what I was thinking with what I have suggested.

Hopefully with these new ideas they can be added and I am open to more criticism and feedback to make this gamemode truly enjoyable.
 

Deleted User 4826

Uncharitable
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95
I agree with most things said for sure, and I'm glad this time nobody is bringing up the skyhigh win statistics (I'm still mad about that one just a bit)

- Decrease the amount of rage given to Hale from airblast from 8% (I think this is how much.) to 3%.
• I understand this would basically remove the punishment that trolls can do, but that's what the next idea goes into depth about. It can stay or go, but it less punishes the team instead of the trolling pyro.
- Give a cooldown to airblast after it has been used too much and/or make it so that after airblast, the cost goes up by 5+ to a max of 100 ammo used per airblast.

Honestly, as a pyro main, 3% is way too low, 4 to 5% would be better. Pyro trolls are unavoidable as much as FAN trolls are, and making hale gain a ton of rage from airblast didn't really stop them in the first place since they're there to ruin the experience for others, and hale getting rage super quickly from spamming airblast just made their job easier

making airblast give rage doesn't solve airblast trolls, but only empowered them, because they're usually trying to ruin the experience for others. I think if all flamethrowers were just adjusted to have similar airblast cost to the degreaser it'd be much better, alongside the 5% instead of 3& that ARC suggested
 

Deleted User 4826

Uncharitable
Joined
Jul 1, 2022
Messages
95
Making a extension to my previous post since I reread this and have more of my own opinions to share.

General:
+ Give players that just join the Versus Saxton Hale server less priority when joining for the day.
• This is just to give people who just join a chance at getting in the server for a player round before becoming Hale the first thing they join a server. Just gives everyone a breather.
Most players who join VSH for the first time dont want to play hale just yet. they want to get their grippings on what all the changes for each class are before trying hale, its one of the first things that makes players not come back almost immediately as soon as they join. If this was fixed, I'd expect alot more players who'll stick around (which means more players for your community, wink wink, nudge nudge.)
- Goomba damage % per player decreased.
• As I've seen it, it can range from 2,000 damage to 500 damage per goomba. All I am asking for is the max damage to at least be lowered so the Hale isn't overwhelmed.
It should deal less damage at max players as it is right now but deal more with less players imo, essentially just tightening the variety of damage to make it much more consistent. Consistency should be important.
- Any taunt kills should deal more damage.
• All taunt kills are extremely hard to pull off but only do exactly 450 damage and I believe a feat should do lots more damage. This would also give more ways to kill Hale in silly and goofy ways.
Maybe taunt kills maybe could deal percentage damage like spy backstabs & market gardens but deal probably less damage overall (7% + 450, maybe?), medics & demo's give full uber & 4 heads on connection respectively, maybe adding bonuses on connection for other classes would be neat too.
Hale:
+ A little bit of decreased knockback would be nice.
• I've seen and have had may difficult times trying to assault an enginer nest and a heavy group with amp and dispenser nearby to help them, it makes extremely difficult as you are thrown away and will have an extremely harder time to try and kill those players as Hale. Vagineer rage uber is the only way to get there as by the time you get halfway, you are thrown away and your rage cannot hit those players or sentries, especially if there is more than one sentry.
Knockback as hale seems to be super inconsistent in regards to how it works. I've seen times where hale seemly takes no knockback despite him having no damage resistance from rage or under a weigh-down, and others where he gets set flying by three bullets from a LVL-3 sentry and is forced to lose a lot of hp just to try and attack a engineer as example. I don't know if this is a feature or not, but it seems really intentional
As for the actual suggestion, good god yes, hale should only get sent flying far away by things that require actual time & setup to make, like a nest of heavies with amps or a sentry nest. And it wouldn't really nerf any other classes besides demo maybe.
+ A little extra health % per player for newer players.
• As we've discussed, there is a way to implement a system to give newer players that have no idea what they are doing a better chance of being able to handle players with more health. I feel like this would be a good decision. Can you also maybe change the tool tip to instead of crouch and look up to super jump, make it right-click and look up.
This would make going after more annoying classes also a lot better, since it'd be less frustrating, I imagine newer players would really enjoy this since it would kinda cushion them a bit and make end of the round scenarios a lot more intense & climatic as-well, as they should be.
+ Christian Brutal Sniper rage range stun is increased a little bit.
• Even though this can conflict with the next suggestion/idea, I feel like this can be a given as Christian Brutal Sniper has a harder time when dealing in close range with his stun as it doesn't give him enough breathing room to make players back up and run. The first layer would soon get replaced with the second layer and he's back to being swarmed once the rage stun duration is over.
His stun needs to be big enough to where he can kill someone with the huntsman at near-medium range to close range, but not large enough where he can easily shoot someone from a mile away with ease when their stunned. His stun range right now is simply too short, and hardly helps him against anything but the odd spy & pyro maybe.
~ Make Hale Rage, Stun Range, and Stun Duration based on the amount of players rather than a set amount.
• I feel like making this change to Hale and his variants would be a good change as it balances it out for all players instead of making a buff to one Hale instead of just one or the other.
This could become pretty annoying honestly and could make it very easy for hale to kill 4 or 5 people he needs to get if he uses it well. I could see it becoming a problem but if its balanced right it should be fine.
- Reduce the explosion radius for Robot Saxton Hale.
• Even though Robot Saxton Hale is immobilized, there are ways to get around this which would catch many players, even myself, off guard. If he is indeed immobilized now, it would be unnecessary to keep his explosion radius where it is currently at.
Honestly in alot of aspects he just needs reworked. His rage is both equally very powerful & very underpowered, being able to wipe entire teams & then also kill only like one person & leave himself open for a trolldier or spy. the only consistent way to get alot of people is by baiting them into small rooms & using it, but that shouldn't be a requirement to use a mechanic which should either give you the opprotunity to take out important targets, kill alot of people, and / or protect you in some way, and Saxtron's current rage does a very poor job at all 3 of these things right now, especially when trying to kill important targets.
Scout:
+ Baby Face's Blaster boost stays for longer.
•The boost duration per hit disappears almost instantly as you get it, which would make sense as you are attempting to run away from a Hale while doing damage, this makes sense. But the instant depletion of that boost is not consistent and I would like it to be increased to give those players a chance at staying alive.
Baby face's blaster definitely needs a slight buff, its even worse than the back-scatter because if you are not literally point-blank range, you will not deal enough damage to fill the meter long enough to run away from hale. turning the weapon into more of a support tool rather than a proper damage dealer similar to the Soda Popper would also be nice, but I'm just spitballing ideas here
- Soda Popper duration is decreased.
• With how long it lasts, it lasts for far too long with what you can do with the HYPE meter duration. You can either deal goomba damage with how high you can jump or jump away many times with how long that HYPE meter last. I am asking for a decrease in that duration for those reasons alone.
Soda popper duration is pretty short as it is, and landing goombas with it requires some practice, so I think its fine as it is.

Soldier:
- Fix the "Guntreads" bug.
• Equip Mantreads and before you get revived after dying or after that round ends, equip the Gunboats and you'll receive the boost from Mantreads and get the damage reduction from Gunboats. I'm asking for it to be fixed to make it fair.
As far as I know, this is not a bug in the normal sense? no other wearables have a bug similar to this and a lot of old legacy players have described it more-so as a feature, and imo it seems a little intentional the way you activate it.

Though my personal thoughts on it? combining both of them & nerfing the total outcome slightly would probably be a better alternative probably, since alot of players dont use mantreads by themselves & gunboats are situational at best by themselves as they're a easy way to surprise hales (and die very quickly if you cant pogo)
Medic:
- Reduce the starting uber from 45% to 10-20%.
• This is way too much considering how fast a medic can get an uber and sustain an uber. If a Hale player cannot pick off the medics, the amount of uber and ubered players will be able to swarm the Hale player, making it nearly impossible for the Hale to win.
- Reduce the given uber from after an uber usage from 20% to 5-10%
• This falls into the first nerf for the medic, it allows the medic to get a lot of ubers way too fast which prevents the Hale from either killing them, or killing other players, making it nearly impossible for the Hale to win.
- Reduce the uber charge rate.
• Again, this makes the Medic way too powerful and is a deserved nerf as it gives the medic less than a minute, making it harder for the Hale to stop the ubers which the medic can get very quickly with how fast the charge rate is at right now.
So, so, so many people have been begging, pleading, mercy-killing for this nerf, even medics think the uber-rate right now
is way too fast.
Sniper:
+ Sydney Sleeper should reduce Hale's rage with fully charged shots.
• As I have been told by many many players, this is not needed but this should've been added and the Sydney Sleeper mechanic could be used in some way like this. With the nerf to knockback based on the charge, this should be an okay change as every other sniper rifle is still usable.
- Have knockback based on the amount of charge you have from being zoomed in.
• This should be a given as any shot, scoped in or scoped out do the same amount of knockback that annoy and pester hale way too much with how the knockback is currently. With no charge, the knockback should be minimal and a fully charged shot should be significant.
- Unscoped shots have little to no knockback.
•The knockback is the same as a scoped shot, but this also allows the sniper to at least escape a Hale player so this change is a suggestion and I am not expecting it to become a thing.
Sniper should be a easy to pick up class in VSH, it shouldn't be a incredibly annoying class to fight against & a occasionally boring class to play though
Climbing already adds some nuance to sniper's kit, so forcing sniper to be alot more proactive with positioning to maximize KB potential instead of just at the 3 prime spots (if you know, you know), it'd just make sniper take a bit more brain to play honestly and it'd be nice.

Also, unrelated, but can we please like commission someone to update and give both reservoir + skyhigh a facelift & bugfixes? they're showing their age.
 

10000 Cold Knights

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Also, unrelated, but can we please like commission someone to update and give both reservoir + skyhigh a facelift & bugfixes? they're showing their age.
Skyhigh could certainly use a rework, but Reservoir is fairly free of bugs afaik. Aside from maybe a cosmetic overhaul I don't think there's much that needs to be done.
 

10000 Cold Knights

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Been thinking a bit about specifically the pyro airblast concerns recently. What do you all think about each consecutive airblast without dealing a moderate amount of damage doubling in ammo cost? EG, first one is normal, second is 40, third is 80, fourth is 160 and so on. Shouldn't affect normal players and would force pyro trolls to do at least some damage to hale to continue their antics.
 

Deleted User 4826

Uncharitable
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95
Been thinking a bit about specifically the pyro airblast concerns recently. What do you all think about each consecutive airblast without dealing a moderate amount of damage doubling in ammo cost? EG, first one is normal, second is 40, third is 80, fourth is 160 and so on. Shouldn't affect normal players and would force pyro trolls to do at least some damage to hale to continue their antics.
They would just taunt for crits & puff hale for a quick 200 or something before doing it again, which would be better, but still wouldn't necessarily get rid of it entirely on maps like skyhigh especially

Also how would the damage even be tracked? Or accurately for that matter?
 

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